This weekend’s rugby promises to be a telling one in many ways.
Both the SA/Australia and the Puma/All Black match-ups will, I believe, provide us with some sort of gauge on what to make of Heynecke Meyer as an international coach.
The Argentina/All Black match is of particular interest due to Graeme Henry’s involvement with the Pumas. I am keen to watch this match with attention for two reasons in particular. First and foremost it will tell me just what to make off last weekend’s Springbok performance; were the Springboks bad or were they made to look bad by a much improved Argentinian side. Just how much did Argentina step-up and/or how much did Graeme Henry accomplished with this side over the last 5 weeks?
If the Pumas do well against New Zealand it will put a totally different perspective on last weekend’s match between SA and Argentina. Was that Argentinian performance at the breakdowns real and due to Henry’s influence or the result of kamikaze home ground motivation and/or an indication of just how piss poor the Springboks really are at the breakdowns? If the Pumas are totally outplayed at the collisions then one should get really really worried about the Springboks in that department of the game.
The second reason why I’ll watch this match with much interest is because it has the potential to reveal to us just how to play the All Blacks. What match strategy would Henry employ against the team that he coached for 8 years? What part of the All Black game are the Pumas going to attack? Are the Pumas going to play within themselves and stay with their strengths or are they going to come up with a courageous approach and try something innovative?
Most people here in NZ believe that the Pumas biggest challenge is in the area of attacking play. Attacking skills and play is not something that you develop overnight and there are general consensus that the Pumas have neither the offloading -ball handling skills- nor the players with the necessary flair to challenge the All Blacks goal line.
South Africa to be honest sits with the same problem in comparison with the All Blacks namely neither the flair nor the refined backline skills to challenge New Zealand with an expansive game. This –fact that the Pumas and SA are in the same boat- will give us therefore an indication just how Graeme Henry would have approached the All Blacks if he were the Springbok coach.
New Zealanders generally believe that the way to beat the All Blacks it to beat them at the breakdowns/collisions; to beat McCaw/Messam/Read at their own game. I am therefore keen to see if Henry is going to advise the Pumas to attack that part of the All Black game or whether he is going to use the same tactics the Springboks seems to favour namely to play to the corners and to concentrate on set piece and defence. The Pumas strategic and structural approach to counter the ‘illegal’-according to many South Africans- New Zealand tactics at the tackle ball rucks is certainly going to be interesting to see if nothing else.
The South Africa/Australia test match in Perth will also provide much information about the current Springboks at the breakdowns. Just how ‘balanced’ are the new loose trio of Vermeulen/Coetzee and Alberts? Is Heynecke Meyer on the right track with the above mentioned combo and just what is his envisioned game plan with this so-called ‘balanced’ loose trio? Can SA really proceed without a fetcher in the loose trio?
Duanne Vermeulen - Is he really the solution and exactly how does he fit into Meyer’s game plans? What sort of game does Meyer want him to play and just how well did he recover after his injury; well enough to last in the cauldron of test rugby? I still believe Vermeulen/Coetzee and Alberts are too similar in style to be considered a balanced loose trio and this test match might tell whether I am right or wrong.
What will Ruan Pienaar bring to the table to make a difference or was it in essence our lack of structure at rucks and loose scrums that hamstringed Hougaard at No9? Will Goossen make a difference with regard to our backline play is another issue that I will try and assess hoping of course that he get enough game time to allow me to satify my curiosity on this particular concern I have about the springbok team?
Can Etzebeth and Kruger reproduce their performances against England or should we stick with Bekker?
Can Heynecke step-up and move beyond high school kick and chase rugby?
Lastly, I believe the Aussie/SA match will tell just how far ahead of the pack are the All Blacks? If the Aussies held SA to a close contest or more importantly beat us it will signpost that the gap between SA and the All Blacks has increased out of proportion. It will, in such a case, disclose how much the experiment with PdV had cost SA rugby; whether that experiment had resulted in more damage than most of us could have imagined.
The Aussie/SA game is difficult to read. Without Bismarck or Chiliboy we don’t have a hooker/fetcher and Etzebeth is also more a ball carrier so we have no-one playing to the ball. Bekker has never been interested in doing the dirty work so I don’t think we’ll miss him.
With all due respect, I dont see Chilliboy as a Bok either. Yes, he may have had a decent game now and then but same as Kirchner, he does as he is told, plays in his position and does what is required but nothing more. Liebenberg is better than Chilliboy but also shouldnt really be there. In my opinion, we sitting with Craig Burden and Deon Fourie who are both agile, strong, fast, can play fetcher and the closest we will get to Bismarck. Unfortunately, Bismarck is a machine which nobody in World rugby can match and I’m sure everyone can agree to that in at least some way …
To be completely honest, the game between SA/Aus wil not tell us more than we allready know, if the boks get smashed, or even just beaten, it will tell us that we need to stop the bash and kick/chase gameplan, which we allready know, if they beat the ausies then it will tel us that Aus has problems, which we allready know! The problem for me comes if we actually beat Aus, then Hm wil just be sitting back and saying ” I told you there is nothing wrong with the gameplan” Which will then just give him another couple of weeks with the same team selections as this 1 and the same gameplan that won’t work anymore, and still morne starting at 10 which is what we know must change!
It’s not about winning or losing against the Ausies for me. It’s about how we play. I am keen to see if there is more to Meyer’s game? Everyone seems to be thrilled with the inclusion of Duanne. I don’t think it’s going to make a difference whatsoever.
How big is the gap between us and the AB? We’ll get a glimpse of that I believe whether we win or loose. Even if we win we’ll know after this weekend whether Meyer can steer us in the right direction. I believe he can’t but will watch how he and his team does on the weekend with an open mind.
I think the same about duane, he needed to keep Daniel for someone that can do something else accept bash it up, and thats why we need Kanko, and to be honest, if Kanko was in HM plans from the start like he said, and Kanko knew it, he would not have signed to play in Japan! I was 1 of the guys that wanted HM to get the job 4 years ago allready, but now i’m actually glad he didn’t and i want him to piss off!
Lol! Poor Div! He is not even coach anymore and still gets the blame! Hahahahaha!
If you read my previous post you’ll see why I made that remark.
I think SA fell behind when the rules changed especially after we lost the two test matches against the AB in 2010. At that moment we needed a strong coach to steer us in a new diection. It didn’t happenen and we are now so far behind the ball game that I am afraid the AB are totally out of our reach.
Can’t agree with you more MU, its much easier to blame PDiv he is not there anymore,is it PDiv fault that Heyneke Meyer plays a outdated Blue Bulls conservative gameplan or chooses sh*tty players???Stop it now it will save you alot of effort when time will tell that Heyneke is not the answer for the Boks.
I am just as disapppointed as the next person with HM team selections. In particuar his loose forwards, flyhalf and fulback. These are key players to provide zip and flair in any team.
That said I still believe HM is a far better coach than PdV. We are playing better rugby for most part. We kick far less and we are actually putting our outside backs in space (go and look at the second Puma test again). We need a bit more fine tuning with regard to varying taking the ball out wide with hitting the advanatge line with speed and directness. Some angled runners that attack space from deep are required in both instances (when we take it wide or when we attack the midfield). Injuries and dumb player selections was part of the problem but mainly the team just need a bit more time together and some of the youngsters got really flusstered in Mendoza.
My point with PdV is essentially that the SARU gambled with his appointment and that gamble are costing us dearly now. South African rugby (that include the S15) is behind the ball game when it comes to playing the fast tempo game. The national coach is the person who should provide much of the direction in how the game is being played and that direction did not happen because the senior players were running the show. PdV also had no influence on the S15 coaches because they did not respect him. Your national coach should be someone that is held in high esteem by everyone in the country in order for him to play the role he should. If you can show me that PdV was respected and listened to by the S15 coaches I’ll agree that he had no negative effect on the development of our game.
I am immensly frustrated by the fact that teams like the Stormers and Bulls and the Springboks just can’t seem to get it in terms of playing the expansive fast pace game.
We needed a coach 4 years ago who was strong enough to convince the senior players and knowlegable enough to improve our structures at the breakdown. We didn’t had one and we kept on trying to win with an outdated gameplan. We then went into the RWC match against Aussie and tried to play an expansive game with players that didn’t play like that for the previous 4 years and lost the match. We had 80% of the ball and still lost the match.
You can call it blaming PdV if you want to but facts are facts. Our game did not evolve at a stage when it should have and now we have a coach that might have been able to induce such a change 4 years ago trying to consolidate with new players while moving on towards an adjusted more expansive game plan. PdV solution to playing expansive rugby was to flirt with player selections including people like Basson, Lambie, Aplon in his team and by starting of with Ruan Pienaar on flyhalf. What was needed was a coach. Yes a coach that could get the basics right like at the breakdowns and who could get our backline running properly.
HM is making mistakes mostly I believe because he does what most of us do when under pressure we stick with what we know. He’ll come around but for know he needs to get the basics of the team right namely proper structures on defence, on attack, at rucks and mauls and develop some core ball carrying structures on which the team can rely and on which other starter and more innovative moves could be implemented.
It took Graeme Henry 8 years to get this All Black team where it is now. He made some serious selection mistakes in his first 4 years and his team did not play with the same flair and daring in the backline that they are doing now in the first 4 years of his tenure.
What HM is trying to do now should have started 4 years ago. He’ll learn from his mistakes but for most part he is taking a conservative approach by trying to get first things right first and that is I believe reflected in his team selections.
Well, it doesn’t really seem if HM is steering the team in any new direction, in fact he is affirming the game (too an extreme extent) that the Springboks were comfortable with at the time. That core squad would never have been able to adapt to the style of rugby that was envisaged by Div back in 2008. Therefore they went back to 10 man Rugby, which by all means worked for most of the Springbok encounters. What was glaringly evident with Div was that the players enjoyed playing their Rugby. The current side….I just have not seen that from them.
The difference with Div was, he allowed the players to play to their strengths and their abilities. Meyer, it seems to me, wants to box players into his little chess pieces and force their every move. Hence, keegan Daniel’s departure who refused to be boxed in (my opinion).
Now if Meyer is such a fantastic coach who everyone (including me) believed he is, taking this side forward after the several retirements, should not be too much of a challenge for him, and I do not believe that with all the talent at our disposal, by just doing the few basic things right, we will be behind the All Blacks.
Blaming Div for not changing a game plan a year before the World Cup is silly. You cannot build ROme in a day, if I may quote our classic coach. What SA did wrong, to the joy of so many of us, was expose the laws in 2009 to the full extent and capitalise on it by beating the All Blacks 3 times and B&I Lions series, while during that very same period the All Blacks were working on their new game. Now do we blame Div for allowing his side, who were all vastly experienced and the best players in this country, to stick with what was familiar in preparation for the B&I Lions tour? Sticking with it during the ensuing Tri Nations? And sticking with it for 2010 in preparation for the World Cup in 2011? It took the All Blacks the whole of 2009 to get their plans in place by 2010. And even with all that time they had, they still didn’t have it easy in the World Cup final. And still with our outdated game plan at the time, we were the better side on the field, and had there been one or two better decisions on the field by our own players, who knows how that would have worked out?
It’s sad that people will now turn around and blame Meyer’s failures on Div. Meanwhile, Meyer has already called back two of Div’s selections. Francois Louw and Juan de Jongh, in place of his original selections in JacPot and JJ Engelbrecht. Hopefully in time we’ll see him pick another in Brussow and another in Lambie. And by then he will thank Div that he gave those very players the game time they needed to come to Meyer’s rescue.
I’ve been saying all along that Meyer is not steering us in the right direction.
I am not blaming Div for Meyer failures. I am saying that we missed the opportunity to adjust our game. I actually believe Div would have liked to play a more expansive game. He started out like that but was swayed by he senior players to stick what was familiar to them.
He was in a tough spot but had the players to start play a high tempo game. His mistake was not his unwillingness but the fact that he did not have the ability or strength of will to force his vision. Hard critism on him I’ll agree but should never have been in that position in the first place. Would Meyer have done better with the team; would he have changed to a high tempo game?
Based on what he have done so far maybe not.
Div was out of his depth in my optinion and jumped around with player selections and allowed to senior players to manipulate him. It took him quite a while to come to the party regarding selection of Brussouw.
I’ll will never be convinced he was the right person to coach that most experienced Springbok side ever. Those victories against the lions and in 2009 tri-nations was based on the fact that the core of that springbokside was also the most sucessful South African S15 side up to date.
I really don’t think, on the evidence of now, that Meyer would have been a better choice at the time to change the Springbok’s style. I mean, he was essentially the founder of the modern day Bulls game plan, which did work well in 2007, 09, and 10….just that hiccup in 2008 which suggests all was not that great.
And yes, Div probably wasn’t strong enough to go forth with his vision of the “expansive” game…but then, I don’t think with the SARU structures, anyone ever will. For all the kak Carel du Plessis and Harry Viljoen was given, their vision just wasn’t shared and the irony of it all was the thumping the Boks gave the Aussies on Carel’s final test.
I also doubt whether players like Smit would have worked well with Meyer. Meyer probably would not have picked him and the side probably would have looked a lot bluer than the world cup winning side we saw in 2007. But that is all in the past, ifs and buts, and nothing can be done about it. It actually doesn’t matter anymore.
I just hope Meyer can be humble enough to admit when he makes mistakes and correct them. Otherwise we’ll never be the best side in the world.
Blah Blah Blue Bull … I think its time HM gets his thinking cap out and start applying new ideas to a depleted game plan and bored-looking squad. Don’t know about you all but the side seems to lack some energy and spunk. The kind of spunk only a proper coach and players such as Bismarck, JP and a few others can provide.
I really hope I’m wrong but in my opinion, against Argentina the Boks looked a little like the Boks under Strauli. I really hope HM doesnt coach the creativity out of the players as you guys mentioned earlier about Daniel. Lambie on the bench is a joke, probably one of the most retarded selections possible. Even if Lambie wasnt available, there are still better players than Zane Kirchner, Ludik, Taute, Aplon … Even frans steyn at FB and de Jongh at Center alongside Jean and then start prepping for a new center like Paul Jordaan for the future …
“Don’t know about you all but the side seems to lack some energy and spunk.”
Agree.
JP is still injured but he would have made a big difference to a lethargic looking backline. Aplon and Lambie is not injured and they will make a difference as well.
We created ackers of space out wide against the Pumas in Mendoza but could not round it of due to lack of flair and poor decision making by the outside backs.
Div inherited Jake White’s senior players and his structures. That was further enforced by a very successfull Bulls team. That team might have continued with their 2009-Hamilton-obtained-dominance over the AB during the 2010 tri-nations if the rules did not change.
I say might have because Henry and his coaching team went to extreme lenghts to improve structures and cohesiveness at the rucks, loose scrums and collisions before the 2010 tri-nations began. Those two performances by the AB against us at the start of the 2010 tri-nations is the best rugby I’ve ever seen by an international rugby team. That is what I call coaching namely when you have your back against the wall and you dig deep and create something special with your team and then back it up with another special performance a week later.
The day SA play rugby like that AB team did in 2010 I will be ready to die a happy man.
For the most part, Div built his team around experience, and in fact showed very little confidence in new faces. Brussouw only featured in his plans once other players were injured. That being said, Div did find confidence quickly in the youngsters that stepped up, Lambie, De Jongh, etc.
HM cannot rely on experience, so he needs to adapt. Although, not relying on experience is partly his fault, you will remember he didn’t want Brussouw against England. The biggest problem for me is that he doesn’t want to adapt. While you are correct in saying we cannot blame Div for not changing the gameplan right before a World Cup, we can (and should) blame HM for not changing it now, especially when he has youngsters for whom it would be easier to change.
Steve Hansen is the new AB coach…. Not Graham Henry.
Yes I know that read again. I am writing about the fact that Henry is helping the Pumas. He has been involved with the Pumas over the last 5 weeks and his intimate knowledge of the All Black team make the Puma/AB match this weekend a very interesting match if you would take he time to read carefully what I wrote.
I agree that this weekend will be a smashing rugby weekend. I also believe that HM needs to keep a close eye on this weekend’s AB/Puma game! As with PDiv that took over from JW after the ’07 WC, Steve Hanson sits in the same boat. He also took a great winning team and now have to try and not mess it up.
Having GreameH on the Pumas side for a change will be very interesting. He is the only guy who would know whether the AB’s has a weakness (if any)! By looking closely where the areas are that the Pumas will attack, will tell HM more about those weaknesses. The Pumas obviously exposed the weaknesses of the Boks (due to GreameH) and after two games HM still didn’t rectify the problem (at the rucks). He is now trying to bring Vermeulen in, which is not the answer!
If GreameH can do the same to the AB’s (with the best loose trio), it will show us not only their weakness, but also the areas the Boks will have to rectify if they want to achieve anything in this Championship and not widen the gap between the AB’s and the rest of the world!
Yip there is much to be learned by the way the Pumas are going to play the All Blacks.
we’ll beat Australia because we are a better team
klaar, punt, verby 
Time will tell. If faith is all we need then yours will do it for us.
Weather forcast for tomorrow in Welly is for rain which I think will probably suit the Pumas but I think the AB’s “should” win. I’m looking forward to seeing Conrad Smith back in action whom I reckon is an underestimated player, his defence is second to none and will be needed against the Argies style of play.
The weather forcast for Perth is sunny and hopefully will make for a great game of running rugby. Personally I’d like to see the Boks under HM play more of a running game. I’m not a Bok fan but I would have preferred to see P.Lambie playing.
Woops, forgot to add that I’m also looking forward to seeing Cruden on the field as well.
For HM’s sake I think it’s worth mentioning that Bismark and a couple of other key players for the Boks aren’t playing let alone a fetcher, is Brissouw (spelling ?) injured or just not featured in HM’s plans at the moment along with Lambie?
Yes it will be very interesting to see how Cruden goes without SBW next to him.
Brussouw was injured and believe he did start playing again but HM indicated that Brussouw is not part of his envioned squad.
Bismarck did leave a massive hole and as a consequence it is now more important than before that HM pick a loose trio that can put some pressure on the opposition at the tackle ball. Duanne is a big defender on the advantage line and I think HM main aim is to dominate the advantage line.
I think HM’s unwillinness to play Lambie is probably the primary reason why the majority of SA fans are losing faith in him.
Other reasons is the persistance with Morné Steyn on flyhalf and the fact that Aplon and Brussouw is not even in the squad.
Hindsight is that Div is a great coach and was put to the sword because of his motor mouth. Divvy is now a proven International coach.
Do you think HM is ,,,?
Can’t say I see your logic regarding PdV and at this stage it doesn’t really matter. HM need to start living up to the expectations and faith many had in him.
The logic is that people keep on battering him when he is no more the coach.
I would also like HM to steer the Bokke on the rightful path of being No1 in the world and I think slowly he his coming to that realisation and is starting to listen to the pundits, bloggers and spectators on how the lineup of the springboks should be.
I would like to say also I am only watching rugby intensely past 3-4 years so I do not know much about HM and only hear about his glory days. So people like me he has lots to prove because what he has achieved I have not witnessed.
Glad you came round and started to watch rugby.
Hoe meer siele hoe meer vreugde is die Afrikaanse gesegde; and it’s great to have you around sharing the banter.
We all have opinions and share our thoughts and that is just part of being a rugby fan; it remains at the end of the day, of course, just personal opinions. Nothing said here is cast in concrete or undesputable truth.
A coach that can take us not only to the No1 position but who will also make us the envy of the rugbyworld due to the type of rugby we play is what I salivate for.
Fact that we had the opportunity with the Jake White squad and missed that opportunity is what I am unhappy about. So I am mostly pissed off with SARU for putting Div in that position in the first place. I will agree he did well under circumstances but doing well when you can be something special is not good enough for me.
In hindsight seeing what Meyer is doing I am not sure he would have done better than Div when the rules changed in 2010.
Awesome posts all! Glad to see some guys can get so passionate about the game. Really hope to see some good running rugby from the AB’s seeing that the winds in Wellington is blowing @ 120km/h. No DC to do the tactical kicking today, so luckily for us cruden is there to give the backline some time to shine.