RWC draw – a conspiracy?
September 28, 2011 in Uncategorized
Andy Wood, perhaps better known as “The General” over at Camp SuperBru, together with his able lieutenant Richard Atkins, have come up with some real World Cup food for thought …
That it comes out on the day that the IRB are being accused of being a little money hungry by the New Zealand Rugby Union, is of course pure coincidence …
But it has long been thought that IRB are just a smidgeon protective of “Their” Northern Hemisphere teams, especially given the success of SANZAR in recent years …
So riddle me this, then:
The RWC draw was based not on the results of the preceding RWC, but on the IRB world rankings at a time when these things needed to be resolved, in 2008. And the top four teams in the world at that time were:
1. New Zealand
2. South Africa
3. Australia
4. Argentina
Now given that in just about any professional sports tournament, the draw is arranged so that the semi-finals should see the 1st seed take on the 4th, and the 2nd seed take on the 3rd, if the results play to the seedings, 1 beats 4 and 2 beats 3, setting up the final everyone wants to see: 1 v 2.
Giving the world what it wants – An All Black vs Springbok final …
Yet for RWC 2011, the intention of the draw was to produce these semi-finals:
1st (NZ) plays 2nd (SA)
3rd (Aus) plays 4th (Argentina)
And as Andy points out: “This obviously massively advantages the 4th seed, as instead of facing the All Blacks, they take on the Wallabies – a much tougher prospect now than they were in 2008 of course, but still the antipodean team you’d rather face”
Further, says Andy: “It was fairly predictable that a northern hemisphere team would supplant Argentina as the fourth seed: England or France.”
So is this the IRB trying to look after one of the Northern Hemisphere sides by giving them an easier semi that would have normally been the case?
Especially since commercially, it’s all about who plays in the final, not who wins it, because TV/media audiences in Europe (the UK, in particular) will be much, much bigger for the final and the week leading up to it if a Northern Hemisphere team is playing, and especially if it were to be England …
For a more thorough look into this, please take a look at Andy Wood’s blog by CLICKING HERE.
Kitchener said on September 28, 2011
Hmmm . . . I wonder how many of these same conspiracy theorists were making similar accusations about the draw being rigged 4 years ago when the Steroid-Boks ended up in the softest half of the draw ever seen in RWC history?
In the last RWC, the Springboks miraculously found themselves in a half of the draw that didn’t contain even one of the other “big 5″ teams. While your chaps were playing easy games against the likes of Fiji and Argentina, in the other half of the draw Australia, New Zealand, England and France had to slug it out. Where were all these conspiracy theorists then?
I must say, it’s funny to see so many Yarpies geting all hot under the collar now that the boot is on the other foot. Come on Wallabies!
hanjooveres said on September 28, 2011
If that is in fact true, The IRB(with a bit of luck) hit a home run when Australia list to Ireland, because now , most likely, France, Wales , Ireland and England will all face off for a final spot, while the 4 Southern Hemisphere teams compete for the other final spot.
hanjooveres said on September 28, 2011
Fiji and Argentina would’ve been Wales and Ireland…but surely you can’t blame anyone but the players and coaching staff of the respective teams for their poor showings at the WC.
AlasdairFraser said on September 28, 2011
Kitch, you know that’s not true! The Boks had your beloved ‘World Champion’ England in our group. It’s not our fault England couldn’t maintain their ‘World Champion’ status by the time 2007 came along.
We gave your chaps a nice little beasting in the pool match and took the high road.
Finished and klaar!!!
GHTr said on September 28, 2011
No No. Fiji and Argentina should have been Ireland and France… France and Ireland lost badly to Argentina.
hanjooveres said on September 28, 2011
okay, even better then, my point was that THIS is a conspiracy theory about the draw, while Kitch is going on about the outcome, which, unless match fixing took place, was just due to one team playing better rugby than another.
uysh said on September 28, 2011
Hi Tank, I actually read about this draw “conspiracy” some time ago (July):
http://blogs.sport24.co.za/Conspirator/irb-fixed-world-cup-draw
I just mentioned this on Darwinia’s post as well:
“GHT, I might have stated it incorrectly in terms of “set up”, I forgot that Aus loss to Ireland was not “supposed to happen”.
I’ve seen this thing about the draw though and I still don’t understand how it is we ended in Pool D while we were ranked second? Actually, its us and Argentina that’s been swopped, so it should have been us in Pool B against England and Argentina in Pool D.
This would have resulted in all likelihood that SA would have faced Australia in the semi final and New Zealand would face England in the other semi final but they way it turned out, with Aus losing to Ireland, it would have been Aus vs NZ in the semi final and SA vs Ireland/Wales in the other semi final.
Hmmmm….imagine that….
So, still the question, why were SA in Pool D and Argentina in Pool B? Conspiracy and if not, did a random draw automatically pick Ranked team 1 and Ranked team 3 in their correct positions?
So, maybe, after all that, maybe I should have said “they set it up that way” ?”
uysh said on September 28, 2011
Not at all a conspiracy in the 2007 World Cup Kitch.
You see, in 2003, the top 4 was England,Australia,NZ, France.
The rest was drawn randomly.
Its not our fault we got drawn with the useless England…
GHTr said on September 28, 2011
I noticed this a while ago and commented on Darminia’s post earlier today. You could look at it that Australia and New Zealand would have been the biggest final in that part of the world. SA was supposed to get Aus in the semi’s but SA is much more likely to beat Aus than NZ, so NZ got us in the in a stadium in which the Boks have been unable to win in recent memory (a draw in 1994 is our best result). We also didn’t play any group game at Eden Park to ensure that when we meet the Kiwi’s we still have that mental block (we will play in Wellington if we top our group or if we are 2nd). But in the end of the day. It’s just a conspiracy
But there is still the question of how we ended up in Group D instead of B??
The2ndcoming said on September 28, 2011
And how bout that Osama bin Laden guy getting “killed” the same year we see the RWC hosted in NZ?
Greencap said on September 28, 2011
I’m gonna go put money on Ireland v All Black final.
This thing is cooked for sure. too many sure things… Rolland, Paddy, Bryce Lawrence.
Pauljay said on September 28, 2011
Conspirator may be right, even if there is a little truth in the matter it stinks!
Mickeynelster said on September 28, 2011
I wanted to ask you a long time ago. Why do you idolize a man that killed 28000 innocent South African women and children?
I cannot undestand why you hate us so much when it is us that should hate you?
Just make peace with the fact that we kick England ass in almost every sport that you invented
Pooh-Bear said on September 28, 2011
If England weren’t so poor and had beaten SA in the groups, they’d have also found themselves in the “softest draw” – what would you’ve said then? It doesn’t matter anyway cos they still couldn’t beat us in the final.
nugpot said on September 28, 2011
Its not a conspiracy, just a good business plan. IRB is not in it for the Rugby, it’s all about the money. And who cares who play who when, if you want to be world champions, then you need to win every team thrown at you. Doesn’t matter at what stage you play them. They were so scared about France winning NZ again that they put them in the same pool to ensure they don’t meet in playoffs. And we know France will never put their A-game in the pool stages. All this boils down to is that SA need to win NZ before the final. This will be the real final. The game in the final stages will just be a celebratory game.
frontrowgrunt said on September 29, 2011
Yep Hanjo, that result played right into the IRB’s hands, guaranteeing a NH side in the final … Unless Italy beat Ireland on Saturday
frontrowgrunt said on September 29, 2011
Certainly looks that way does it not?
frontrowgrunt said on September 29, 2011
Yep, as you and Uysh point out, the Pool B/D thing is also suspicious …
frontrowgrunt said on September 29, 2011
Based on this – http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/news/newsid=2027987.html – It seems the top 4 seeded teams were randomly drawn into the 4 pools … Conspiracy over?
uysh said on September 29, 2011
Did anyone see the live random draw take place to make sure it was in fact “random”? I cannot recall it being broadcast live like the soccer draw, with auditors and the likes at hand to verify the legality of the process.
Besides, why should it be random in any event? Why not stick with the way it was always done with 1 to 4 being A – d?